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conservatives
January 2009 
No Red America, No Blue America, Just One America
Keith
I have other blog sites that I frequent. I stopped posting on liberal blog sites long, long ago because my positions seemed to either antagonize or not reach people. I have chosen instead to post here. That is . . . till yesterday . . .
I read this post on Crooks and Liars. The title says it all . . .
No Red America, No Blue America, Just One America
Crooks and Liars is a "liberal" blog. But they posted this letter . . .
"I am a conservative who spent one evening responding to posts on your blog. I mentioned then that I would support Obama if he won, even though I was supporting McCain's campaign. I feel it was my duty to send my congratulations to our next president through you and your community, since I used your forum to enter into a spirited debate. I will honor my pledge to respect Obama as our American president. I certainly intend to exercise my first amendment rights to try to persuade him and others away from policies that I oppose, but I will be respectful of him and his office. I will also reprimand others who fail to show such respect.
I do not plan to return to this site, as I got so engaged in the vigorous debate that I lost track of time, and I missed saying prayers with my kids and tucking them in that night. We have added our new president to our prayer list. I assure you, we are not praying from a sense of self-interest. We only pray that he be granted the wisdom that is necessary to successfully execute his duties in a way that leads our country to greater peace and prosperity.
I believe it is un-American to wish ill upon anyone in order to gain some advantage. I want America to reach her greatest potential; therefore, I want Obama's presidency to be the most successful in history -- until the next president is elected, whichever party that person might represent, then the next president, and so on.
Who knows -- perhaps I'll end up voting for Obama in 2012. I will remain open to that possibility.
Please share this message with your community."
Whoa! What's going on here?!?!? As of this writing there are already 201 comments and the conversation is still going. Yes, you read that right. Liberals and Conservatives are . . . {{{GASP!}}} . . . actually having a conversation!
Buried in the comments of this blog was this (very lengthy, but excellent), originally posted in 2005 just after the 2004 presidential election, where liberals were still scratching our collective heads wondering what went wrong.
I had already read something quite similar to this before, but this was an excellent overview and helped bring things into perspective. Liberals and Conservatives have two divergent perspectives which result in non-communication.
I'll only pull out a couple things, which are self-explanatory . . .
The Conservative Mind:
The Liberal Mind:
Is it any wonder, then, we have failed miserably at understanding one another? When Bush bombs a country back to the stone age, he's only doing his duty as Strict Father and authoritarian. When liberals cry "foul!" we're perceived as weak.
The article ends with this . . .
There is a lot to promote about liberalism and the Negotiated Commitment model behind it. We take people as they are, rather than demanding that they fit themselves into an increasingly outdated set of roles. We face problems directly, rather than making people jump through hoops that may or may not be relevant. And so, for example, we ask: “Who is going to feed the child, teach the child, protect the child, and love the child?” rather than “Who is going to be the father and who is going to be the mother?”
The Negotiated Commitment model is tolerant by its nature. It recognizes the freedom of other people to negotiate their own commitments differently than we negotiate ours. In a country whose citizens have so many different backgrounds, and a world with so many cultures - each with its own notion of inherited obligations - such tolerance is a necessity.
We are committed to maintaining and extending the social safety net. We are committed to giving everyone an opportunity to succeed. We are committed to finding common ground with other countries and building a global consensus that works.
And, in spite of the cultural values that currently divide us from the working-class families of Kansas and Shawmut River and thousands of other communities around the nation, we remain allied with their economic interests. For some people that will never be enough, and we will never get their votes.
But many, given an accurate view of liberals and the values that motivate us, may come to see that we are not so scary, and that their differences with us can be bridged. And as the plutocratic agenda of the Right lets jobs continue to be lost, wages continue to stagnate, and the gap between rich and poor stretch ever wider, they may recall that the New Deal was not such a bad idea after all.
I felt compelled to post this for one reason: Should we consider the possibility that this year's presidential campaign resulting in Tuesday's awe-inspiring and historic vote represent a paradigm shift not only between the two sexes and different races . . . but also between the two bitterly, bitterly divided philosophical camps in the US?
Can we actually have healing between the Right and the Left?
Has this decades-long, raging battle, per chance, reached its zenith?
Access: Public
HI … great post! Its interesting to think about the nation coming together … but as I saw November 5th, we have a long way to go yet before we truly create a “more perfect union” … perhaps that's the greates thing about America!
To your first question … paradigm shift … the two sexes the shift is not yet at critical mass; the races, i think that that had already happened for the critical mass, but this election just gave us a really great opportunity to show it was true; two bitterly divided philosophical camps … personally, i see little difference between the two besides some logistical issues, but little in terms of philosophy.
Second question … of course there's always room for healing, but first, we have to define and identify what is right and left because those are misnomers for what they once represented. there is much room for mutual stroking right now, because they have found some common ground they can be proud of, but they also are realizing that they have found a common enemy.
third question … not yet, I truly believe not yet … not if the left really represents what they want to believe they represent. but, the truth being told, if the left did that and the right believe what they once represented long ago: small government and strong individual rights … they would find they were on the same page once again too … but both “left” and “right” are in denial of their true, historic identities for which their names used to represent.
The left: “We take people as they are, rather than demanding that they fit themselves into an increasingly outdated set of roles.” Ok … prove it, “left side” … I do not believe it. IF this election was such a “win” for the “left” … I do not believe you. Not when in every opportunity it was presented – including in CALIFORNIA! - all of the same-sex union/marriage were banned … I do not believe the “left” and what it wants to claim is its identity.
I'm straight. I'm married. I'm a mom. I'm so conservative, I turned in my “Republican” card this election for a “Green” card. I was raised in a born-again evangelical home. I do not discard my faith only its false judgment of others, as I do not believe that is what I was taught was the right thing to do. I am an 'american' … lower case, the kind that believes, “all are created equal” means that everyone deserve to have the same rights as me, no matter how i view their life and the differences that may represent.
so, if you really want to talk about healing, let's be real and not delusional or in denial of our reality and see the bigger picture that is beyond our personal agenda issues: e.g., let's show the world how we are no longer racist – how we have overcome that lie. WHICH IS WONDERFUL … but when out of the other side of the mouth comes that lie in a different flavor … things that make you go “hmmmmmmmmmm.”
The hypocrisy of this election and all this “make nice” between the two sides is because it has been decided that “there's a common enemy” and both left and right went after it with ruthless abandon and as much venom as they used to have for one another.
Just some thoughts as we go down this road in unchartered territory … can we expand and really embody the truth that “all are created equal” no matter what that equality may be?
peace & harmony,
elaine
'freedom must be exercised to stay in shape!'
What a fantastic comment!!!!
Yes, you live in California and the battle rages still. In California … go figure? I too am left scratching my head that the majority of blacks voted in favor of restricting civil rights. Not logical at all, but the reality of the election. The outrage that this could happen is quite real. I'm sure many there are still walking around in dis-belief. It truly defies comprehension.
My upbringing was also fundamentalist Christian and I, also, rejected the judgment without denying faith. But I grew up in the south. So my life-experiences suggest less issues between the sexes, but still major issues between the races. Racism, unfortunately, is still very much alive and well.
So, perhaps, we should not look upon Tuesday's election as a paradigm shift for race relations, but more of a major step in the right direction. We'll have to re-visit this event in fifty years or so to see which is correct.
You do highlight a problem with “left” philosophy. Where do we stand specifically? Who knows and who cares … because it'll change tomorrow!!! The “live and let live” philosophy allows for so much fluidity that it's difficult to formulate a “concrete” stance. I do, however, prefer fluidity over rigidity because this allows for change and compromise while adapting to an ever-changing environment.
And lastly, you hit a home run mentioning “common threat”. People can accomplish great things when we cooperate. Splintering off in various factions with each screaming “Me! Me! Me!” has never worked.
So, I have yet another question. Are you suggesting, per change, that the reason Obama and the Democratic party won this election was due more to the lack of cohesiveness (i.e., the coalition falling apart) of the Republican Party than a coming together of the Democrats?
As a woman who grew up in the “deep south” in the U.S. and lived in other countries and other states before returning to the south I find this post and the comments like reading my own journal. As someone (cannot remember now who) posted on November 5th the Oprah quote that Barack is a unifier and that instead of red and blue states we have the Color Purple! I love it!
Keith, I had no idea we had so much in common!
I am riding this tide of change! I am thrilled that it is here!
Love, Light and Laughter,Starseed
Yep! I tell everyone that I was privileged to have “escaped” from the south!!! (Sorry southerners!) I love the Pacific Northwest!!!
So, Starseed, I know exactly how you feel and what you have to endure on a daily basis.
Keith - thank you for posting this article.. i spent all morning reading & thinking on it. Last nite i watched an amazing documentary.. not necessarily for the faint hearted.. some of it was a little on the brutal side… Although it was all very tastefully shown… the link to it is here.. Manda bala it was a Sundance favorite… it highlighted what a world of the haves vs have nots looks like in another country. And after reading the link you posted .. the last sentence:
And as the plutocratic agenda of the Right lets jobs continue to be lost, wages continue to stagnate, and the gap between rich and poor stretch ever wider, they may recall that the New Deal was not such a bad idea after all.
I couldn't help wonder how all of this ties in to each other. In Brazil the divide between the rich and poor is so great.. the wealthy now spend a great deal of money on their personal safety.. and if perhaps they had the foresight to realize they could've spent this money on 'helping' to uplift the poor & safety might have prevailed… through fairness.
And also to add on the California election of the same-sex marriage ban… experiencing the commercials from those wishing to pass the ban… was an unbelievable barrage of fear based marketing. I was astonished at what was in those ads. Mostly centered around children being taught the gay life style in school… by watching what was being presented to californian's through this marketing 'horrific' play on fear… it was no surprise that the votes went in the direction it did. However, there is also an amazing thing to note, that even through the exteme manner in the marketing.. it was a close vote. This gives me hope that it is only a matter of time before we can get equality passed either via voting or back into the courts. Hope prevails in me now more than before… Obama's win was a beginning - and the words he is using in my opinion is what can help evoke change.. words & drawing the proper bigger picture :)
This entire post here has given me much food for thought — for me to simmer on for days & weeks ahead. Keep it coming :) we'll get there.
Hugs,
Lisa
I did not go to the link you provided because … I didn't have to. I lived in Central America for two years and got to see it up close and personal. A mere 3% of the population live in absolute luxury … and the other 97% in heart-wrenching poverty. There was at the time and is a growing middle class, but they still struggle. Walk through any upper-class neighborhood in Latin America and all you see are prisons, as you stated. That's the way I saw them, people building fortresses to protect themselves from “the masses”.
That is exactly where we were headed … until Tuesday. We changed the trajectory.
What a great blog, Keith….thanks for putting so much into it and for doing it so well!
I think there could very well be a paradigm shift occurring and some healing, too. I know that I'm feeling some very different energy over here in the Northeast. Some Republicans have been admitting that they regret having voted for Bush the 2nd time around and are expressing a lot of support for Obama and optimism re: the future.
Overall, there's something much lighter/more positive in the air…finally…and that—actually, all of it—is a big deal! :)
I do believe the planets are lining up for the change we have been waiting for. I wait with calm, unbaited breath…
To PEACE! S
Democracy was originally a “system for accomplishing what can only be achieved by citizens joining together with other citizens” so the answer to ALL three of your final questions must be …
ALL UNION FROM DISUNION TOWARDS REUNION
I feel it is time!!!
I knew I was always a liberal-of course that is what people have ALWAYS told me; people have gotten so angy, they have called me communistic. Not true. I am very happy that my husband, for the most part, has turned away from being conservative to a democrat. I am learning that most democrats, and people for Obama, are kind and spritual individuals.
I know Obama will try his best; no one can expect him to do everything. I cannot wait for his presidency.
As a future psychologist (addiction counselor), I am big into nurtue.
Hi Keith,
That Liberal vs Conservative TALK comes from the linguist Lakoff, as I presented in my blog here, before the election…
Moral Politics: consertives & liberals Posted on Oct 9th, 2008 by Peggy J George Lakoff
… among linguists that have come to be known as the “linguistics wars”.
Lakoff's original thesis on conceptual metaphor was expressed in his book with Mark Johnson entitled Metaphors We Live By in 1980.
Metaphor has been seen within the Western scientific tradition as purely a linguistic construction. The essential thrust of Lakoff's work has been the argument that metaphors are primarily a conceptual construction, and indeed are central to the development of thought. He says, “Our ordinary conceptual system, in terms of which we both think and act, is fundamentally metaphorical in nature.” Non-metaphorical thought is for Lakoff only possible when we talk about purely physical reality. For Lakoff the greater the level of abstraction the more layers of metaphor are required to express it. People do not notice these metaphors for various reasons. One reason is that some metaphors become 'dead' and we no longer recognize their origin. Another reason is that we just don't “see” what is “going on”.
For instance, in intellectual debate the underlying metaphor is usually that argument is war (lated revised as “argument is struggle”):
He won the argument.
Your claims are indefensible.
He shot down all my arguments.
His criticisms were right on target.
If you use that strategy, he'll wipe you out.
Additional resource:
Frame trumps fact!
Progressive vision: we envision an America where people care about each other, not just themselves, and act responsibly with strength and effectiveness for each other.
Progressive values: caring & responsibility, carried out with strength; protection, fulfillment in life, fairness freedom, opportunity, prosperity; community, service, cooperation trust, honesty, open communication.
Progressive principles: Equity, Equality, Democracy, Govt. for a better future, Ethical business, Values-based foreign policy.
IN TEN WORDS:
Stronger America… vs… Strong Defense
Broad Prosperity… vs … Free Markets
Better Future… vs… Lower Taxes
Effective Gov…. vs… Smaller Gov….
Mutual responsibility… vs Family Values
And check out Lakoff in Wikipedia too…
Good stuff.
pj
I am intrigued as to HOW ALL OF THE ABOVE fits or does not fit with NESARA ?
Keith, i am so glad to have come across your blog… i find the “Strict Father Family” and the “Nurturant Parent Family” models to be illuminating as a means to understand the conservative 'right' and the liberal 'left'…
Thanks for adding space in the world for conversations to take place between/among differing points of view… we need more and more of that (space adn tolerance) to surmount the challenges we have in front of us.
Namaste.
Agreed!! Thanks for commenting!
To support Nishta's comment I would suggest this interview is well worth reading.